Lebe (0s):
In 2016, I also started my YouTube channel because back then I was just your regular personal trainer. I did my gym instructor license, and then I worked at a gym. And then I left the gym. And then I got self-employed and decided I'd do my own thing as a personal trainer. And I was the generic personal trainer, right? Doing, you know, everything, some barbells and dumbbells. And then I bought some kettlebells because somebody told me there was an education that I got. And the guy told me, if you want to get started with kettlebells, you gotta go get yourself some competition kettlebells. 'cause they're all the same size. One of the beautiful thing about kettlebells is the, the ballistic nature. This is what, What separates the kettlebell from everything else, people who run in circles. So we need some general recommendations. So that's number one that I have an issue with, with the fitness industry.
Lebe (42s):
While I think it is true, we also need some general recommendations and some clear facts where you say, listen, this works and this doesn't. And so the second thing in, in, in the trainers industry on the fitness industry is
Brian (53s):
This week I interviewed the founder of Lebe Stark and a certified master of Sport in Kettlebell Snatch Gregory Jamali Gregory has helped thousands of men and women over 40 build strength, burn fat, and train pain free with his powerful hybrid kettlebell system. We discussed the advantages of using kettlebells versus traditional weights, along with the simplicity of using them, What separates kettlebells from everything else. His kettlebell training, certification, Training and Recovery for 40 plus year olds. And his one tip to get your body back to what it once was. Really enjoyed my interview with Gregory. I know you will too. Thanks so much for listening and enjoy the show.
Brian (1m 33s):
All right. Welcome to the Get Lean, Eat Clean podcast. My name is Brian Gryn and I have Gregory on Welcome to the show.
Lebe (1m 41s):
Oh, I appreciate it. Thank you so much.
Brian (1m 43s):
Yeah. Glad to have you on. Your business name is Lebe Stark, and we were just saying how people think that's your actual name, but your Gregory Demali, is that right? Is that that fair? Right.
Lebe (1m 54s):
Almost. It's, it's, it's not that easy to pronounce, right? Yeah, it's, it's Gregory, that's the, that's my, I was named after Gregory Peck. This was a famous actor back in the day. And my, and my mother loved him. So that, that's the guy I was named after Gregory. And, and the last name is Jamal. So that's an Albanian surname from the eastern part of Europe. But I'm actually, I'm, I'm of Roma descent, so these are gypsies. So it's a very, very interesting backstory. And yes, Lestock is the business name and yeah, I live in Switzerland, so Yeah. A lot of things come together. Exactly.
Brian (2m 31s):
Yeah. And when did you, maybe give a little background, when did you start your business? I know it's all about kettlebells. So we haven't had anyone on the podcast to talk about kettlebell training and we're both over 40. So I think this'll be good for the, the audience to, to get a different perspective on ways to train. And when did you start getting into kettlebells and, and turned into a business? Well,
Lebe (2m 52s):
In 2016, I decided to become self-employed. That's when I had enough resources to at least make it one month I remember. And I told myself, you know what, if you now try it and you get rid of your job or you, you leave your day job and you try to make it on your own, you can at least survive one month. So that's, that's a good, that's a good outlook. And that was 2016. It's almost 10 years ago. It's crazy. Wow. That's great. So next, it's crazy. Next year we celebrate our 10 year anniversary. This is this massive, yeah. We talked about how fast time flies. Right. And in 29, 20 18, 17, around ish in 2016, I also started my YouTube channel because back then I was just your regular personal trainer.
Lebe (3m 38s):
I did my gym instructor license and then I worked at a gym and then I left the gym and then I got self-employed and decided to do my own thing as a personal trainer. And I was the generic personal trainer Right. Doing, you know, everything, some barbells and dumbbells. And then I bought some kettlebells because somebody told me at a, at a, that was an education that I got. And the guy told me, you know what, you gotta, you, if you want to get started with Kettlebells, you gotta go get yourself some competition kettlebells. 'cause they're all the same size. Hmm. And so I did this, but I had no clue. I had just the basics. Right. The bed lifts squats, that's if you have a little bit of a fitness background, that's, these are the exercises that you can get down pat pretty, pretty quickly.
Lebe (4m 18s):
Yeah. And then afterwards, I did a video in German back then I was doing videos in German about kettlebells. And I thought, you know what, five, the five best kettlebell exercises and that video took off. And I was like, wow. So it seems like I learned back then in 2016, I heard that if the market is reacting to a certain piece of content, or maybe even to a product or a business idea, you have to follow its trail. Right. And that's what I did. So I decided, you know what, let's jump into Kettlebells. And I was your typical influencer, so I did not, I, it didn't know anything, but I taught people how to do swings and stuff. Right, right. Yeah. That's why I make reaction videos nowadays to these types, to that type of content because that's where I come from.
Lebe (5m 3s):
And then I've heard of Steve Carter who unfortunately passed away for those who, the audience who don't know Steve Carter is a legend, was a legend in the kettlebell sphere. And he passed away when I think he was 53 or 54 heart attack at the end of January. Crazy, crazy story. And I heard of Steve Carter, I reached out to him because I knew he is the, the kettlebell dude. But I also heard of Strong First and, and, and RKC and pa but I, I didn't vibe with these guys. This was too much the tough Guy approach. And Steve Carter was open-minded. He was all about, it was, it was, it was about the person and not about the tool or or building building, building a brand, so to speak.
Lebe (5m 44s):
And, and not, I mean, it's okay to build a brand, but Strong first. And Pablo is always a little bit cultish to me from the beginning. And then Steve Carter, I invited him in 2019 into my gym and he certified Angie and me. And yeah, back then, ever since then we hit the ground running. Then 2020 the pandemic happened, everybody jumped on Kettlebells, we had to close down the business. Right. Because I have a, I have a personal training gym. Okay. And then I took a deep dive in Kettlebells and since then yeah, I didn't look back. So yeah, it's brought me where I'm today.
Brian (6m 15s):
Yeah, that's a quite the story. And you know, it's interesting because I talk a lot about like micro workouts, you know, 'cause I, I think like even during the pandemic, I started doing these like short 20 minute, 30 minute workouts just to get it done. And it just takes the excuses out. And I noticed that with like a lot of your workouts, 30 minutes, 20 minutes, you know, you can do like five things and just be done. I think that's what the beauty of, you know, you could do that with, you know, body weight exercises. You could do that a lot of ways, but you know, kettlebells are a convenient, sort of easy way to sort of just implement into your life. And,
Lebe (6m 51s):
You know, you mentioned body weight and Pablo UL said this in a, in a podcast with Andrew Huberman, and he's totally right about it. Body weight seems very innocent. You, a couple of squats, a couple of pushups. But if you've never moved in your life, try to hit the ground and do 10.
Brian (7m 9s):
Right.
Lebe (7m 10s):
You won't be able to do it. Pushups are tough and body weight squats are one of the exercises that you, you have to know how to squat. And then it's great for the knees. And that's an exercise that we teach as well. So it's not that that hard, but for example, a burpee is also a great exercise, But it's also pretty tough. Yeah. And so body weight, while you always have your body with you, it seems innocent, But it takes some, some, let's say some already little bit of an advanced level of fitness to really get a good workout in. And with kettle valves, the beautiful thing about it is you can, you can incrementally load them, you can progressively load them. You can use an A KG, get started with a 12 kg and then slowly progress your way up.
Lebe (7m 51s):
And that's the beauty about it. And you mentioned the 30 minute mark. This is something that I always try to keep in mind when I train my workouts with warm up and cool down, since we get a little bit older, older, we have to warm up a little bit longer. So my warm up takes about seven, eight minutes mobility, and then a couple of swings, couple of snatches, and then I move into my main workout. And my main workout is always approximately 30 minutes. Yeah. Yeah. And I'll always make sure I stay in the 30 minute range and I get, I, I get the best of GPP. So I believe kettlebells are the ultimate form of GPP, which stands for general physical preparedness. So if that's what a lot of people look for, right.
Lebe (8m 31s):
A little bit of mobility, a little bit of strength, a little bit of endurance. I wanna elevate my pepper knee potential. I wanna save time. I don't wanna do 10 exercises, I don't wanna go out to the gym. So you can get your GPP with a couple of exercises. I'm a big fan of three. For example, my current workout is Jerk is thrust, jerk and double half snatch with double be. So that's three exercises. I do 10 reps, or I have a ladder, I do 10 reps with the jerk, then eight reps with the double half thrust, double half snatch, snatch, and then six with the thrust jerk. And so then I have one set, I do four sets. That's my kettlebell main stuff. And then I do some body weight, some pushups, some pull-ups, some dips. And that's my main workout on two days of the week.
Lebe (9m 14s):
And I absolutely love it. It's just, it's awesome.
Brian (9m 18s):
Yeah. And I think keeping it simple is the best way to go. And like, you know, like you said, you have three main exercises that you focus on. I think sometimes people can be overwhelmed, you know, they go to a gym and there's like all these different machines and, and all these different ways of, of doing exercises. And you know, with kettlebells, I, I implement them a little bit. I'm not like, I'm not like, it's not like the main focus of my workouts, but I like 'em because I think you can do different things that dumbbells don't allow you to do, which is like, even just like kettlebell press-ups where you're just like trying to stabilize And, you know, work on just like stabilizing the shoulder and, and the rotator cuff and things like that. And I think that's what attracts me to kettlebells at least.
Lebe (9m 58s):
That's awesome. Yeah. And you know, one, one of the beautiful thing about kettlebells is the, the ballistic nature. This is, this is what, What separates the kettlebell from everything else. Swings, especially snatch and, and depending on what type of style you are doing. I just recently was in a competition where I had 10 minutes and I had to do at least 100 reps with a 32 kg kettle belt to get my, my degree that I wanted, which is masto sport. And so with the snatch, you have everything in there, you have a little bit of strength, you have some endurance, you have mobility, you have pacing, breathing. Right. Which is incredibly important. And this separates the kettlebell from everything else.
Lebe (10m 39s):
You pick up the bell, you do, you do a, let's just say you start easy 30 seconds of snatch per side. Right? So that's the ballistic nature of it. Swings are awesome too. But once you really dig deep into kettlebells, clean jerk snatch, this is where the good stuff is. And this is What separates the bell from everything else. And I agree, when you, when you press the bell up, which we do with kettlebells, we do that a lot. Right. Jerking or pressing, you always go overhead. And that's something that many people don't do in their daily lives. Right. When they go to the gym, they push in, in, in, in depth range. Range. Right, right. But when you go overhead, so many beautiful things happen. Even more people who have banged up shoulders. And you are absolutely right when you press the kettlebell overhead, so much stability is going on in the shoulder joint, which Yeah.
Lebe (11m 24s):
Other tools don't give you the same. And so that's why I always say the kettlebell is the best generalist tool, the best GPP tool. That's what almost everybody wants. Especially especially the over 40 and 50 crowd. Right. And so that's why the kettlebell shines most definitely.
Brian (11m 42s):
And I like using 'em for like farmer's walks or like suitcase curies. They're good for that Yeah. As well.
Lebe (11m 48s):
Yeah, awesome too. Exactly. Have you, especially the suitcase.
Brian (11m 51s):
Yeah. Yeah. The suitcase cur. Yeah. No, I, I love using it for that. Have you, like, obviously being in your forties now, you're turning 41, you said in a month or so, how is, how is your changing, how has your training evolved from when you first started? Well,
Lebe (12m 5s):
This is my, I started lifting seriously in 2009. So that's my 16th consecutive year of training. And in, in my early days, I was doing probably what everybody was doing. Right. The typical bodybuilding stuff. Right. Inspired by Arnold And, you know, bodybuilding. That's what I think many of us get into. And now as I grow older, I love the time efficiency aspect where I know I got everything sorted out in 40 minutes. So 30 plus. Right. If you deduct the warmup, you can also say, you know what, I make a i I make the warmup part of my training where I just use some swings and some walks for warmup.
Lebe (12m 46s):
That's awesome too. So the time efficiency and heart rate training heart rate has become a big interesting, big, big, big part of my training. Yeah. Yeah. And I use my Apple watch and I stick it around my ankle with this magnetic band like this. Okay. Because when you train with kettlebells, your, your wrists have to be free. Right. And I always, a client of mine, he always did this and I was like, oh, I gotta try this too, because I always wanted to track my workouts, but I couldn't because with this big, I have the ultra. And so when you, when you clean a kettlebell properly, it always, even if you pull it very low, it you're supposed, we always say you're supposed to tray hands free and wrist free. Right. And so now heart rate training became very, very big because I realized that I was, I probably spent a little bit too much time in the, in the zone five or in the, in the red zone, so to
Brian (13m 34s):
Speak. Right. Like burn almost burning out a little bit.
Lebe (13m 36s):
Yeah. And the funny thing is not even during training, because I built my system up to a level of tolerance where I can tolerate fatigue pretty well. But the issue is I feel it afterwards, you know, being a business owner, having a family And, you know, doing everything, it just adds to the level of stress to a certain extent. And I recognize this and realize this a couple of years ago. And so with heart rate training, it got way better. So I can still focus on, on going hard, but I also realize that if I, for example, do double jerk, so jerk is bell overhead falling into a second, second dip, fixating the bell overhead back into the rack. If I do a set of 10 reps with a double 20 eights, so 20 eights is, what is this, 58 pound, I think for American.
Lebe (14m 25s):
Yeah, yeah. So 2 58 pound or 56 something. Right? Right. So when I do 10 reps with double 20 eights, my heart rate jumps up to 180 immediately. Wow. And so I used to, didn't pay enough attention to my rest. Yeah. Or making sure that the heart rate goes back down. And since I now pay attention to it, because Now I have more quality time on attention because if I do a burst set with a very heavy weight and my heart rate jumps up, then I have to wait until my heart rate goes back to maybe, let's say 1 50, 1 45 is perfect, but one 50 is is minimum. Then my central nervous system is recuperated and I can go back at it again and get some more quality time and attention.
Lebe (15m 9s):
And that's a big thing that I've also realized I, I'm, I'm big on time on de tension. So you mentioned, right, 30 minutes is your timeframe where you want to train. And so if you want to get a lot of results out of it and a lot of benefits, make sure you spend enough time on a tension, which means make sure you're not distracted, put your phone away, stay focused with the workout, don't rest too much depending on what type of training you do. If you focus a little bit more endurance, then you can rest a little bit less. But if you're going into speed explosiveness and strength and muscle building with burst sets, it makes sense to rest a little bit longer. And so then if you're big on time on the tension, I now differentiate between time on the tension and quality time on the tension.
Lebe (15m 50s):
So if your central nervous system has enough time to recuperate, your prime movers can push, put more tension into the exercise. Which means if you look into the, if you look at the, the size principle of the muscle, which means if you, if you, if your central nervous system is already weak or already tired, this means your muscle is not fully working even though you go through a very heavy set. And so it might still be time and detention, but it's not that good quality because you didn't rest enough. Right. But then at the same time, don't rest too long. Right. Because you don't wanna fall out of the groove of training. And so that's why, that's why I love kettlebells and I love digging into this stuff.
Lebe (16m 30s):
This is so fascinating.
Brian (16m 32s):
Yeah, no, you make a good point. Like, you know, you're stressing the system And now that you're using the heart rate monitor, you're understanding like where, where you get to a point of like being recovered to some degree. So you're able to explode and, and come back with, you know, that much more, you know, that the same amount of effort that you did the, the set before. I always say that, you know, you like I use like sometimes I'll do like the rogue echo bike, you know, like the, the one that a lot of CrossFitters use. And if you go hard on that, like you kind of
Lebe (17m 1s):
Make sure you the salt bike, right. With arms and Yeah. The
Brian (17m 3s):
Salt bike. Yeah. That thing is just oof
Lebe (17m 6s):
That thing is brutal. Most definitely.
Brian (17m 9s):
Yeah. I don't, I I should do, I, I don't, I should use it more. I don't, I mean I, I always say for something like that, you don't need to do it a ton. Right. Like especially, you know, once a week or twice a week at most, maybe if you want, depending on what you're training for, but like something like that, I talk about high intensity repeat training where you're allowed to give yourself enough time to recover so you can come back and repeat that same set in Exactly. With the same amount of effort.
Lebe (17m 34s):
Exactly. Exactly. And this is what, it's funny because this is what I read, I just finished this book. This is, this is an awesome book
Brian (17m 41s):
Science.
Lebe (17m 42s):
It's called the Science, the Science and Practice of Strength Training by KY Kramer and Fry. Okay. An awesome, awesome book. KY was quoted by PA often and this is, I think that's the the third edition. Yeah, it's the third edition. And I read through it and a lot of it goes in line with what, what Kansky says. So I'm big, big fan of the Soviet literature, the old Soviet literature of, of sports science. And this is exactly repeat training. You say, or I think they call it the dynamic, the dynamic effort or the dynamic effort method. Yes. It's, you go all in and then you rest enough and then you come back at it.
Lebe (18m 25s):
Then there's the sub maximal effort where you say you go not all in, you just say like I for example, my 10 sets of my 10 reps of one jerk with double 20 eights, I could probably do, I could crank out maybe 15 or 20, but then I'm completely gassed and then I'm probably going to towards muscle failure or, or system failure. Kettlebells is, they're not just, they're not just taking your muscle, they eat your soul alive. That's what they do. Right. So it is systemic failure. So depending on, on the method that you're trying to use, it's, it always makes sense. This is how differentiated, if you focus on strength, muscle, and explosiveness, they are, I, I put them in one category.
Lebe (19m 5s):
You usually use heavier weights, you usually use less reps and you usually lose more rest. So that's one section of training. Right. And SAT even says in this, in in the book science and practice of strength training always put strength first. So I have a principle, I call it first SRST, which means first strength, then stamina. So I always focus that the strength, which I consider muscle building and, and explosiveness and speed. I put that in the same category. This comes first because this tax is essential nervous system like crazy. And then afterwards you can do some imams when you focus on strength, endurance or endurance. And so the key, the key here is to understand, for example, you mentioned CrossFit.
Lebe (19m 48s):
I, I think CrossFit has great ideas. And I also think that they, that they mess up some of the training systems. So if we say we use EMOM, which I love, this is such a great way to train. You have one minute of work, you have one exercise, you do eight reps or five reps, whatever the amount of reps is. And then you rest until the next minute begins. This is a great way to train. Then you have rest and training baked into one system. You have 10 minutes. So 10 imams. And now let, let's say we have 10 imams, 10 minutes with 10 snatch. Right? Great. You don't have to think, you let the timer do its thing. You count your reps, you rest, you walk around.
Lebe (20m 28s):
So this might work well with a snatch for example, with a lighter weight where I say, All right, for me, let's use a 24 kg. I do 10 to 15 reps, or let's, let's stick with the 10 reps. And then this is rather strength endurance for my level of skill. Maybe for somebody else it's too heavy, they have to maybe use a 10 or a 12, doesn't matter. But you have to use a weight that is not too heavy because it's not supposed to take your central nervous system tax, your central nervous system too much. Because if it does and you don't have enough rest, you probably burn yourself. Right. Does that make sense? So it's always make sure that the strength part has enough rest for the central nervous system to recuperate. But then when you walk into strength, endurance and endurance, you can reduce the rest a little bit and and stay a little bit in that red zone.
Brian (21m 15s):
Right. I'm, I'm assuming like when you're doing more of an endurance base, you're doing a little bit lighter kettlebell and having less rest time and then for the more of a strength. Exactly. Yeah. You're just doing a heavier with more rest.
Lebe (21m 28s):
Exactly. So one thing that I would never do or that I stopped doing, I wouldn't do the double 20 eights. Right. Jerk. I wouldn't do six reps for 10 Emos, I wouldn't do it. I
Brian (21m 41s):
Know. What does the e eon stand for? Just so people,
Lebe (21m 44s):
Imam is, again, it's, you do the sixth jerk. Okay. The minute starts ticking, you do your six reps and then you have rest until the next minute begins. That's every minute on the minute. That's I
Brian (21m 56s):
So if it takes, so if it takes you, oh wow. That's, yeah. So if it takes you 20 seconds to do that, then you get 42nd rest.
Lebe (22m 3s):
Exactly. Yeah. And even if I am able to crank out the six or eight or whatever reps in 20 to 30 seconds and I have 40 to 30 seconds of rest, I know that it's not enough. Okay. 'cause the weight is so taxing that I need more rest. But if I would say I, if I would use 1 28 lighter and do eight jerk lighter, that's okay. Right
Brian (22m 28s):
Now you got me motivated to get into kettlebells.
Lebe (22m 31s):
You have to. I'm ready. That's my job.
Brian (22m 33s):
But you know's what I do. You know, I mean I've been, you know, like, you, like I started lifting, I was 18, so ish 17, I'm 44. So, you know, it's, I, I think like having these conversations and learning different modalities is like important. 'cause I think you can, you know, you who knows, 10 years from now you might be doing something else. I don't, you know, I don't know. I'm just saying it's good that to have these, like the tools in the toolbox. Right. Where would you say, like if you know I'm in the states, but like, like I know you mentioned first strong, right? What's like a good strong first? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Strong first. I knew it was, where's a good place to get started if someone wanted to just learn kettlebells and get, get certified, putting
Lebe (23m 12s):
You on the spot here.
Brian (23m 14s):
And if you don't, honestly, you know, you're in Switzerland, so there's probably different places there than there are in the States. We
Lebe (23m 20s):
Have Yeah, yeah, yeah. We, it's, it's, there's, there used to be, I used to recommend the IKFF because that's, that was my sensei Steve Carter. But since he passed away, I'm not sure how the IKFF is run now. Okay. So that's the International Kettlebell Fitness and Federation got fitness IT inter International Kettlebell Fitness Federation. So I'm not sure on how they're run Now. I KFF. Okay. Then. Yeah. Strong first in RKC. That's a great place to start too, that they, they teach a different style or a different idea of kettlebells. And then we also offer a, a certification program. And we have, we, we've certified a couple of trainers who now work with us as well. Nice. And what I do differently, because that's what I was missing, what I do differently is I have a mentorship, so it's not a weekend course, but with me, you're going through a at least 12 month mentorship.
Lebe (24m 13s):
You mentioned, you mentioned the toolbox, right? So you can, you can look at this from two perspectives, depending on who the audience is. If you have an audience of coaches, here's what I would say, yes, it is generally recommended that they tell ya we have to, you have to use all the tools in the toolbox. Here's the key, then you'll always be trained a number four thou, or 4,250,301. You'll be lumped in with everybody else because you do everything, but you do it average. Right. I'm a little bit blunt here. And so in today's day and age, what I have seen is my specialty with kettlebells put me on the spot.
Lebe (24m 53s):
And so the kettlebell gives me everything that I need. I still think barbells are awesome. I think body weight is awesome. I think dumbbells are awesome. I I, I love all these modalities, but like I said, I think the kettlebell gives you the GPP, the general physical performance, which almost all over forties and fifties, over fifties need. That being said, as a trainer, yes, you have to look at it maybe from a, from a perspective, a bird's eye perspective, but you must specialize. It's, that's, that's my take because that, that was my journey. Maybe I'm a little bit blindsided because that's my experience, but I always liken it to the, to the doctors and the surgeons. You can be a regular doctor who takes patients like 45 patients a day, right.
Lebe (25m 38s):
Where you treat everything a little bit and if something needs specialty, you refer out or you become the guy or the gal that gets referred out to. And I'm a big fan because I've seen it in my practice, I've seen it in my success. I've seen it the way that I do business now. It's my specialty is setting me apart. So that's something to consider. I know everybody says in the fitness industry, they say a it depends. I hate that. Even though it's true. I, I hate it that everybody gets this recommendation. It's like in fitness. Well, what's your goal? Well, I wanna, I wanna do this and that. What should I choose? Well, it depends. All right, so then you give the second answer. Yeah. Okay, so I wanna do this and that. Can you gimme now a clear answer?
Lebe (26m 19s):
Well, it still depends. Do you wanna build strength or muscle? Well, you get what I'm saying. It's, people need some general recommendations. That's the reason why they tune into YouTube. Imagine all fitness influencers would always say it depends. People would run in circles. So we need some general recommendations. So that's number one that I have an issue with, with the fitness industry. While I think it is true, we also need some general recommendations and some clear facts where you say, listen, this works and this doesn't. And so the second thing in, in the, in the trainers industry or in the fitness industry is exactly, this is what you mentioned with the toolbox. Yeah. Be a be like the jack of all trades and master of none to a certain extent. And then you'll always have this, you'll always, you'll always compete with everybody.
Lebe (27m 2s):
So I stopped competing with everybody. Yeah. I'm building a right. A, a a a. Well, I was a sea of my own. Right.
Brian (27m 11s):
I was gonna say, yeah. I mean, for you being on YouTube and, And you know, specializing in Kettleballs, I mean, I think having a niche is important. I was just saying that like being someone that's been lifting for so long, it's nice to have no different modalities that you can come in and out of And you know, 'cause sometimes things get old and boring, you know, like, you know, for a while I was doing resistance bands. Now I've come back to more traditional lifting. But but yeah, for you having, you know, your specialty being kettlebells, I think that's why your channels probably has done so well, is because, you know, they know exactly where to go if they wanna learn about kettlebells. And, and that's, you know, that's, that's obviously a, a good niche to be.
Brian (27m 52s):
And
Lebe (27m 52s):
You know, the interesting part is also that it's not just the niche on YouTube, it's, it also spills over into my coaching business, my in gym practice that I have. Yeah. I, I target the over forties and fifties. I have seen that the, it's, it's, it's an interesting story. I started doing kettlebells and then I started focusing solely and exclusively on kettlebell training on what we do. I have seen that the average age now in our gym is 51. I have seen that 55% who watch our YouTube channel are between 40 and 57. So this told me right from the, from from the start, are realized a certain demographic clicks with kettlebells.
Lebe (28m 37s):
And that's that age group, right? And so Now I target that age group, and of course you, you know how it goes. You, you have to give them, give them what they want before you give them what they need, right? So, hey, do you wanna get strong fit and lean without going to the gym? Here's my ebook. So this is how I reach out to the over forties and fifties. I say that's exclusively for the over 40 and 50. And then once I have them in, I then teach them the method and say, well, what we use is this. Right? And we are the specialist here. Right. And that's the reason why I have the over 40 50 program. This is the tool that I used. I'm the specialist.
Lebe (29m 18s):
And I've seen that this has changed our business tremendously. And even you mentioned boring, right? This is what I get often. So imagine one of the cool things about the kettlebell, especially if you learn the, the Russian style, the, the kettlebell sports style. The cool thing about it is it is such a intricate, detailed style that requires a lot of skill. And so if you are an ambitious person and you pick up a heavy kettle bell, or you pick up a bell and you start to learn snatch or the jerk, and then you work with a coach who can show you the intricacies on the details of these particular styles, especially the kettlebell sports stuff. And then your ambition kicks in and you say, I want to learn this exercise because A, I love it.
Lebe (30m 4s):
The enjoyment is awesome and my, my body loves the exercise, and Now I want to get really good at it. So that's what we've seen with almost everybody, even people who never lifted weights in their life. Hmm. And they say, I want to get really good at it. Not everybody, but a huge chunk says, I want to get really good at this. And so then it doesn't get boring because you always focus on, you have variation in the basics, but you always focus on the core principles with some slight variations. You really want to get good at this. And then at the same time, you get results. So, right. So yeah, this, this, this eliminates the boring perspective of it.
Brian (30m 39s):
Well, that, yeah. I mean, it's important. I think enjoyment is, is a big part of people coming back and being consistent. Like, and if, and like with kettlebells, if they can enjoy that over anything else, I think that's, that's important. Also, as far as like injury prevention, how do you feel like kettlebells have a leg up on other traditional lifting modalities?
Lebe (30m 59s):
I don't have insights on, on a particular depth with other modalities where I can say, listen, I've worked over 10 years with barbells and that's what they did. Right? So I can't, I can speak for the other modalities, but what I can tell ya is that we get so much feedback, not just in gym, because that's a very small percentage of people that we, that we coach in our gym, but from all around the world. And that is, my back gets better with swings, my shoulder gets better with swings or presses, just the kettle, but just the ballistics in general, my mobility improves enjoyment. You mentioned enjoyment. So they stick to it. So they improve their, their physical ailments. And we work with everybody, arthritis, frozen shoulders, artificial knees, artificial hips, all physical ailments that you can imagine are in our gym.
Lebe (31m 50s):
And we work with these people. And of course, I'm transparent. I'm not saying that the kettlebell is the cure to everything, but we see that it has some therapeutic benefits. Most definitely.
Brian (32m 1s):
I like to ask this question to most people that come on the podcast. What's one thing you've changed your mind on in the past 10, 15 years? And it doesn't have to be even kettlebell related, could be something else.
Lebe (32m 12s):
I Oh, many things. Many things. Yeah. If, let's, let's take something completely different, okay. Than kettlebells. I used to think that love was a feeling until I realized that love is a decision. So that was a major game changer. So if, because you know, when, when you're in love, you know, it's all, all, everything's, everything's rainbows and stuff. But then when, when, when life, it's, it's like with training, you're motivated. You want to travel to the moon, you are ready to rock. I'm ready. I got this. Oh, I can't wait. And so then life comes back in, right? And then it, it becomes a decision. So that's something that I've realized. Interesting. So love is a decision that, that's a big one. That doesn't mean that feeling is is not involved at All.
Brian (32m 54s):
Right? Right.
Lebe (32m 55s):
And, and, and, and attractiveness and everything, of course. But when you spend time with, with a person for a very long time, and I've been with, with Angie now for, yeah, 10 years. Last year was 10 years. And so that's a milestone in all by itself. And we've told ourselves it's now, the more time I spend with her, the more I realize I have to make a conscious decision to please her, to do things that she likes to, to, to, to not always get mad when she says something about the household, because she's, she's the queen here. She takes care of everything. So that's, that's fine. So that's something that I change my mind on. I change my mind on training, often, often, often.
Lebe (33m 35s):
So I, I used to, I used to think completely different when it comes to training. I used to only focus on muscle, and I thought, this is the only road that everybody should travel. It's always aesthetics and muscle and, and leanness, until I've realized, well, you know, health is very important. It's not, for many people, it's not that important, especially for, for our crowd of how they look. Not saying, again, same with love, that aesthetic aesthetics doesn't matter at All. Right? But there are other components that become way more important.
Brian (34m 7s):
What do you, so
Lebe (34m 8s):
That's, yeah. What
Brian (34m 8s):
Would you say you focus on outside of kettle balls as far as like nutrition, recovery? Like how do you, how do you, you know, stack your day and, and, and make sure that you're getting those things as well?
Lebe (34m 19s):
Well, I keep it very simple. I try to, I try to go to sleep early. Not some, not easy. I try to spend less time on this thing,
Brian (34m 28s):
The phone. Yep.
Lebe (34m 30s):
Yeah. That's again, not easy. And as far as recovery goes, I have to listen to my body a little bit. No, eight years the key. I have to listen to my age. It, it's funny, right? I always used to think, well over 40, 50, who cares? You train the same, go all in until I realized, well, I think I have to, I still love intensity and I love heavy weights. And especially when you master a skill, you always want to go, go, I always want to go there. I always want to go ball to the walls, right? And I realized I need deloading weeks. So I, I need, there are some weeks where I have to use intentionally. I have to force myself to use less weight.
Lebe (35m 12s):
And then as far as nutrition co goes, I try to keep it simple. Make sure protein with every meal, protein from every type of source, and make sure you keep the processed stuff as, as, as little as possible. So what we do is on the weekends we go out, once Angie and me, we go out. So we go to eat every Saturday. We eat out in our favorite restaurant. That's just 10 minutes from you.
Brian (35m 36s):
How's the food in Switzerland? Well,
Lebe (35m 39s):
It's awesome. It's awesome. A friend, a client of mine, he was, it's one thing that is so interesting, a client of mine, he's from Pennsylvania. So he came to Switzerland because of his job. And then he asked, he said, Hey, can I visit? Can I come over and visit? I said, of course you can visit the sanctuary. So he came over and we had a session was awesome. And he said, Hey, you know what's crazy? I lost three or four pounds while I was in Switzerland. I said, Hmm, how come? He said, well, no snacking culture. And I said, Ooh, interesting. So we talked about it in our recent session. I said, well, can you explain a little bit? He said, well, in the US or at least where he is, he says, I have access to food every second at the house.
Lebe (36m 24s):
Then when I go to work, they have a little snack bar right. Where the employees come together to put in stuff, and then you pay some honorary fee.
Brian (36m 34s):
Ah, okay.
Lebe (36m 35s):
And so he has always access to food every time. And, and, and I mean, you guys in the states, your, your stores are open 24 7, right?
Brian (36m 42s):
A lot of times. And there's, yeah, there's, I mean, yeah, there's a, there's a Starbucks on every corner, so Yeah. You know, right. And, and I'm assuming, and you are
Lebe (36m 52s):
Open in the middle of the night, right? I could, I could go get often, right?
Brian (36m 56s):
But depending on where you're at, like, I'm north of Chicago, but you know, it depends where you're at that, but there's usually something open 24 hours. But, and I'm also assuming with Switzerland, and maybe, you know, like they use less of these like artificial flavorings and ingredients that, that are allowed in the foods in, in the states. And, and I'm assuming Switzerland's, I'm sure there's junk food in Switzerland, but perhaps it's Yes, it's a little bit, I don't know. There's, there's more of a restriction on,
Lebe (37m 23s):
On that. I think the major, the, the, the major difference is the sizes.
Brian (37m 26s):
Okay.
Lebe (37m 27s):
The portion sizes, you guys have massive sizes. That's when, when the first time I was in the States, I saw, I saw a red Bullhead, and I was like, whoa, I could, I, I could sip on this thing for a week. What is this? And so in, in Switzerland, the, the, the portion sizes are completely different. And, but still, but still, obesity rates climbed up in Switzerland, I think in the, in the seventies or the eighties was like, and they lumped together overweight and obesity, right? They lumped it together. And I think in it, it was in 20%, something like 30 or 40 years ago. And now we sit at 47 or 45. Really?
Lebe (38m 7s):
So every second person in Switzerland is at least overweight, it seems. So, right? Everybody has the issue, the western diet is, is an issue. Yeah. So that's, we're not, we're not exempt from this, but the difference in our case is, again, our stores mostly close at seven or eight, and then that's it, right? But that doesn't stop people from buying stuff and then hoarding it at their house and then always having access to it, right? Which is one thing that we recommend where we say, listen, maybe, maybe you cut down a little bit so that you don't have that stuff all around, because if you have it always in your house, somebody's going to eat it, right? And so I try to, I, I try to keep, it's a very simple, simple, basic approach. And, you know, you see a lot of this, the cold plunges and, and the, and, and all, you know, the typical rogan sphere stuff where people really grind out on, on recovery.
Lebe (38m 58s):
I just make sure I sleep enough. Yeah. I get some of my vitamins, I make sure I have some healthy sources of food and, and I train. Yeah. So yeah, that's it.
Brian (39m 8s):
And you, and you train, you do your kettlebell, it's pretty much a total body workout, right? For the most part. You're not like specializing in and then you're doing that, what, like three days a week or four days a week? Or
Lebe (39m 20s):
I train, I train between four and five.
Brian (39m 22s):
Four and five. Okay.
Lebe (39m 23s):
Yeah. 30 minutes. That's because I'm, yeah, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm just, I'm addicted to it. So that's why. But, but if you, if your goal is just, if, if you're not like me and you're not, not a fitness crack head or a kettlebell crack head, you can still say, Hey, how much do I need to change my levels of fitness and get results? And I always say, the best question to ask is how many times do I have to train over the year, not per week. And so if you can get 50 to 60 workouts per year, you're golden. Now, if you wanna optimize and then really change your looks, change your physi, you can take it to the next level, then we always say, the better you wanna look, the more results you want, the more sacrifices you have to give.
Lebe (40m 5s):
Right? But at, at the foundational level, it's pretty simple. One or two workouts a week, make sure you train 50 to 60 workouts the year, and you're, you're golden. You're going to change, almost guaranteed. And you, you met you an, you asked about the differentiation between full body or split. The only thing that I focus on is, is it rather a strength endurance day or is it rather a heavy day with, with burst sets? Right. And so I do burst sets twice a week. So I just, today was Friday, so I did burst sets. Wednesday I did my burst set, the same principle. Oh no. Wednesday I was outdoors. Loved it. Another awesome thing about kettlebells, you'll pick up your bell, you put it in your trunk, you drive down your, your sports field or whatever, you take it outside the trunk, you do a couple of cleans, swings, presses, snatch.
Lebe (40m 58s):
You run a 400 meters, or that's 200 yards or whatever that is. You go back to the bell, you do some swings, you run again. This is, this is so awesome. It's such a great way to train. And on Monday we have our regular GPP stuff where we combine everything because that's where the content day is. And we film the workout of the week for our kettlebell plus members. And then on Saturday's, always a little bit experimentation and rather light. And then when I, when I'm really all powered up, I do Tuesday and, and Thursday I train as well, but not as often. These are usually my rest days. And then I do rowing one kilometer with the water rower, and then a couple of snatches, and that's maybe like a 15 minute workout.
Brian (41m 39s):
Sounds good. And what, what would you say, what one mistake that people make if they, when they get into Kettleball training?
Lebe (41m 45s):
I think that it, it depends on where you come from. So the most people, when they come from a, a fitness background, the regular gym bro background, or you don't even have to be a gym bro, just your regular gym style training. They always, they have a similar question. They come up with, well, how do I split? Right? So we kettlebells you don't, you can, but you, I mean, you can have, you can use the kettlebell, like a wheel shaped dumbbell. Of course you can. But the first mistake is treating the kettlebell like a regular gym machine. Dumbbell. Barbell, right? The second mistake is being too tense. So that's a major thing that people realize with kettlebells.
Lebe (42m 27s):
You have to be, you have to understand when to contract, and you have to understand when to relax. So you become subtle and you become fast, right? So it's tension and relaxation. And another major mistake is thinking that you, that you have to use 25 exercises, but that's where many people come from, right? When in the gym, you have machines, right? You have your elliptical, you have your treadmill, then you have, if you train at Planet Fitness every Monday night, you get pizza.
Brian (42m 53s):
Oh, I didn't know about that.
Lebe (42m 55s):
Yeah. So, and so you come up with this idea that you think you have to do 10, 15 different exercises and, and the minimalistic approach of kettlebell since it's full body. And of course you can tweak a little bit. You can say, okay, let me focus a little bit more on upper body. Let me focus a little bit more on the legs. You can, but it's still, it's always a systemic training. So systemic efforts, your whole body is taxed.
Brian (43m 19s):
Hmm. Love that. Now I, you're getting me motivated. I'm gonna be doing some, I'm gonna follow some of your videos.
Lebe (43m 25s):
Go ahead. You have to, you have to.
Brian (43m 27s):
Yeah, no, for sure. And we'll finish up with this question. What's one tip you'd give someone who's, you know, 40, 50, 60 plus, who's, you know, looking to get their body back to what it once was maybe 5, 10, 15 years ago? What one tip would you give them?
Lebe (43m 42s):
I mean, yeah, I'm biased, of course. So I would say really consider picking up a solid kettlebell and consider the approach that you don't have to train every day. You don't have to change your life. You don't have to do a 180, you just have to change a little bit, but stay consistent, right? Consistency is the major issue with, with people who get started. Yeah. So if you just do, and let's say use a very generic example. Every, every other day you do 50 swings, or 20 or 10, and then you go up to, maybe you start with 10, then it's 20, then it's 30, then it's 40. Let's say you end up with 50 swings every other day.
Lebe (44m 24s):
You do this for a full year, you're gonna change. So, and it is so simple, but the crazy thing is right when, when you look at fitness and when you look at other areas too, right? It looks so complicated because you think you have to do all these crazy things that you see the influencers do. Or you hear me say, I trained four to five days, oh, I gotta do this too. No, no, no, no. You start easy, you start small. Keep it simple. Stupid. Stupid, right? The kiss principle, and you stay consistent.
Brian (44m 52s):
Love that. Well, Greg, this was great. Where's the best place for people to find you and, and learn about you?
Lebe (44m 58s):
Very simple. You go to YouTube, you type in kettlebell, and I guarantee you, you'll find me there.
Brian (45m 3s):
Yes. And you go under your I I'm, you say it better than I do. So
Lebe (45m 8s):
Yeah. Livestock, that's,
Brian (45m 10s):
I don't wanna say it sounds, when you know the, it sounds good when you say it. Yeah. I, I sound like American, you know?
Lebe (45m 17s):
Yeah. The leap, star, lip, star, leap, star. But you know, it's crazy. It's Now, I, I thought when I got started in 2016, I told myself, I'm gonna use a German name because every trainer around here as an English name, And now that we are international, I'm like, man, I should have chosen an English name. But so many people are like, no, no, no, no. Stick with it. I'm like, All right. It's like Ramstein, like the, the German rock band.
Brian (45m 41s):
Yeah, yeah.
Lebe (45m 42s):
Ish doc. That's what it is.
Brian (45m 44s):
Love it. Exactly. Love it. Alright, Greg, thank you again. This was a great conversation and we'll, we'll put links in the show notes so people can find you.
Lebe (45m 52s):
Yes, sir. Awesome. Appreciate it. Thanks
Brian (45m 54s):
For listening to the Get Lean, Eat Clean podcast. I understand there are millions of other podcasts out there, and you've chosen to listen to mine and I appreciate that. Check out the show notes at Brian Gryn dot com for everything that was mentioned in this episode. Feel free to subscribe to the podcast and share it with a friend or family member that's looking to get their body back to what it once was. Thanks again, and have a great day.
